Racialism should be away from spirutual matters. Races dont matter before god. All people are one under GOD. Let all live together as brothers and sisters.

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flitcher

Christian Drug Rehab

http://www.christian-drug-rehab.org

I don’t think any political party doesn’t stand for issues that are not contrary to the word of God.

Republicans controlled 3 branches and abortion is still a federal level “right” and invetro-fertilization is still allowed even though all fertilized eggs are not used.

How do you rationalize it?

You should have asked what I meant. If you had asked, I would have written that even though some people say race shouldn’t matter in issues of faith, Price had a year long series on how some have made it an issue. Or I would have written how CeCe Winans has said she has had to alter how she did her music to reach white audiences. Or how Anointed stated they weren’t played on “Christian” stations because they are Black and considered “gospel” or that one white radio host refused to play their records until he heard them in concert, felt convicted, approached them, and apologized to them for looking at race instead of faith. But you didn’t.

We’ll have to disagree on the meaning of Ms. Wilson’s rhetoric, as well as your both rather dogmatic interpretations of scripture.

What these letters represent is where your argument falls flat. I’ll explain.

“…you’re misinterpreting the passage.”

If you are having a hard time with that scripture, then I know Matt 10:37-38 will really mess you up. And yes you are more than welcome to read the whole passage just in case you believe this is taken out of context.

For the Christian, the Bible is the absolute word of God as supported by 2 Timothy 3:16 “All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness.” The scriptures I presented in this post are not opinion. They represent what God has stated regarding the two issues I discussed in this post.

“In so far as Jesus acknowledged human politics and faith have their respective spheres (John 18:36)…”

Completely and 100% wrong! Let me post the passage you mentioned in your comment:

Jesus said, “My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jews. But now my kingdom is from another place.”

The big point you are missing with this scripture is that this is where Christ was laying down his life (if you will) for the sake of his kingdom. There are two passages that put this scripture in context

Matthew 26:50-54

Then the men stepped forward, seized Jesus and arrested him. With that, one of Jesus’ companions reached for his sword, drew it out and struck the servant of the high priest, cutting off his ear.

“Put your sword back in its place,” Jesus said to him, “for all who draw the sword will die by the sword. Do you think I cannot call on my Father, and he will at once put at my disposal more than twelve legions of angels? But how then would the Scriptures be fulfilled that say it must happen in this way?“

Christ had the ability to call for help from his father but chose not to because doing so would have violated all the prophecies that foretold that he would be as a sheep to the slaughter. Here is another passage where he was in the garden of Gethsemane before he was taken to Pilate:

“And he withdrew from them about a stone’s throw, and knelt down and prayed, saying, “Father, if you are willing, remove this cup from me.Nevertheless, not my will, but yours, be done.” (Matthew 22:41-42)

Again, here Christ was struggling with what he wanted, but came to the conclusion that God’s will had to be done. He essentially ‘died’ to what his own desires for survival.

I can point to you numerous examples in the Bible where this level of sacrifice is emphasized. As I eluded to earlier, obedience to God’s word (the Bible) for the Christian should be our daily mission here on the earth. Christ was obedient to his death and since we are ‘Christians’ (Christ-like), we are to do the same. All Christ had to do was to renounce his claim that he was the messiah and his natural life would have been spared, but he didn’t. All the apostles walked this path as well as the thousands of Christians who were persecuted in Rome and even up to today in countries like China and Indonesia.

I interpreted Ms. Wilson’s point as accusing ‘Black Christians’ of heresy for participating in politics.

I didn’t. I read it as she stated her case. Nothing in her commentary accused ‘Black Christians’ being guilty of heresy simply for being involved in politics. Her entire argument pointed directly to the unchallenged dilemma amongst many Black Christians who support a party that has joined itself with the pro-abortion, pro-gay movement (two issues that the Bible has clearly pointed out as wrong). Eradicating societal ills such as racism is a good thing, but for the Christian, yoking ourselves with an entity who has clearly crossed boundaries laid out in the Bible for whatever reason is plain disobedience to God’s word. I have laid out many of the scriptures that support this point and have yet to see anyone produce any scripture that suggests that it is okay to place natural needs over God’s word.

Your question of ‘Black unity’ versus Christianity is a false dilemma.

No, actually this is a real dilemma where you have clearly demonstrated your inability to support your opinion that cultural needs can supersede God’s word with scripture.

IMO, you’re misinterpreting the passage.

In so far as Jesus acknowledged human politics and faith have their respective spheres (John 18:36), it would stand to reason that one’s embrace of a racial identity is completely compatible with the practice of Christian philosophy.

I interpreted Ms. Wilson’s point as accusing ‘Black Christians’ of heresy for participating in politics. Again, there’s no theological merit to her argument as civic life was seen by Christ as a separate realm over which he neither claimed authority nor argued its respective rules (for lack of a better word) were antithetical to faith/the Church.

Your question of ‘Black unity’ versus Christianity is a false dilemma.

Apparently you did not remember our last conversation. Man, that is okay.

My Mom just got in from the airport and I am trying to find someone with firewood so I have moved on a bit until later on this evening.

Yes I remember bringing it up before but it was way off topic then and we didn’t really discuss it much… Here I believe it IS THE topic. In your question you state, “… who have traditionally voted for Democrats while claiming to be a follower of Christ as taught in the bible.” If you are a strict literal follower of the Bible, as in every word, in every version, is direct from GOD and must be followed exactly then I do not understand how you can say some things are okay to skip over and some are not.. However if you read the Bible in a fashion that allows you to take the moral code from the passages but not necessarily take every word of it as law then you take from it different meanings of things. My “taught in the bible” is probably different than your “taught in the bible”. This IS the answer to your question. This is not off-topic.

With that I will shut up now and let the rest of you discuss because, as I have said in the past, I am not a very religious person… I have studied religion though and just found the majority of it just wasn’t for me.

Wizz, we already had this conversation before. Please stick to the original question of this post:

“So all of this brings me to a very simple question to my fellow Black Christians out there who have traditionally voted for Democrats while claiming to be a follower of Christ as taught in the bible. How do you rationalize your vote for a party that supports issues such as the ones I discussed here while still believing you can still be a Christian?”

Aren’t there thousands of things in the Bible (Old and New Testament) that people no longer follow literally anymore because our culture/society has deemed them not right, or not necessary (i.e. sacrifices, eating habits, keeping of slaves, ..etc). How is it justified not to follow those things.

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By whom?

Used by the people who promise you they are going to do something to stop abortions.. They know full well they won’t. Why? Because it is completely against what the majority of Americans want. It would be the end of the republican party if they actually did something about abortions and they KNOW it. They are just using it to get your vote.

Keep that in mind with the person your are currently supporting.

Obama has already done things for issues that I care about. And I believe we are on the same page on abortions. As for things he is proposing to do I have no reason to believe he won’t because they are in line with what the majority of American people want… So he has no reason not to get them done… unlike the republican party stance on abortion..

Since when did Fred Price become the replacement of what the scriptures say regarding these issues? I pointed them out for your own personal consideration, not what someone else said. We do all have our own opinions, but how does one sacrifice one portion of scripture for cultural reasons?

politicians must be considered to be amoral at best. Given that, I can say that Christians shouldn’t vote or be involved in politics at all except for some single issues. Isn’t that an extension of your choice not to vote?

I think that if those single issues come at the expense of me compromising my faith in other areas such as what I mentioned above, I would have to go with my faith in God’s word—otherwise, it would not be called “faith”.

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So, it’s natural and logical for the worldview (’politics’) of ‘Black’ people, or people who identify themselves as ‘Black’, to be influenced by racial sensitivities over religious beliefs. Especially in a country with a secular government.

The greater definition of race is how one defines himself. Putting race above Christian beliefs goes completely against what Jesus said in Luke 9:23-24 “Then he said to them all: “If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me. For whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me will save it.” This passage serves as one of the main tenants of the Christian faith. Race is very important, but nothing is to supersede are commitment to Christ as he left us with his own example on the cross (the symbol of what the Christian faith is about–sacrifice).

I have yet to see a ‘Black’ version of Hinduism or Buddhism, yet it is commonly accepted that these beliefs have universal principals that transcend race. Christianity is no different in how it goes beyond race, however, it is based on sacrifice that at times goes beyond what we want or deem as important at the moment. Again, this is what defines a true faith in God. Anything less is something that you can control. If that is the case, who needs God?

The problem with Ms. Wilson’s hypothesis is that it presents ‘Black Christianity’ as inconsistent with secular government.

I read her piece again and at least to me it sounded that she was referring to government being inconsistent with Christianity in general, not ‘black Christianity’. I agree with the former.

Also, Black Americans are largely aware of a history replete with U.S. politics where Christianity and the Bible was used to justify our exploitation and maltreatment.

This is true. It is also true that Christianity wasn’t the only source of ‘justification’ of slavery and Jim Crow.

The simple answer to Duane’s question is Black voters differentiate their private beliefs from their political beliefs — as do most American voters, regardless of religious affiliation.

But again, this brings us right back to my original point. How can some claim to be a follower of Christ but allow their culture to supersede Him when they deem its necessary? Although this discussion is about culture, there are other things folks use to supersede their “faith” when convenient. I say that when this happens, that person has no faith at all.

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But if you are using that as a sole issue to persuade your vote, then you are pretty much setting yourself up to be used.

By whom?

People will just promise you that they will do something about it to get your vote. But when it comes down to it they will never really do anything about it.

Keep that in mind with the person your are currently supporting.

If you do not believe in abortion then preech that within your family so that it does not happen. And do whatever is necessary to take care of any babies that may happen to come… But if you are using that as a sole issue to persuade your vote, then you are pretty much setting yourself up to be used. People will just promise you that they will do something about it to get your vote. But when it comes down to it they will never really do anything about it.

The problem with Ms. Wilson’s hypothesis is that it presents ‘Black Christianity’ as inconsistent with secular government. That’s quite an irresponsible statement, given that a secular government protects the individual religious freedoms that would likely be prohibited in a sectarian state. I’d like to believe that of all Americans, Blacks understand intuitively the difference between a secular government and state atheism, especially given the evolution of the civil rights movement. Also, Black Americans are largely aware of a history replete with U.S. politics where Christianity and the Bible was used to justify our exploitation and maltreatment.

The simple answer to Duane’s question is Black voters differentiate their private beliefs from their political beliefs — as do most American voters, regardless of religious affiliation.

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. The derisive use of “RINO” comes to me right now.

Race doesn’t matter in matters of faith.

Fred Price and others will tell you different.

Duane, here’s my thought: politicians must be considered to be amoral at best. Given that, I can say that Christians shouldn’t vote or be involved in politics at all except for some single issues. Isn’t that an extension of your choice not to vote?

You are courageous to even think outside of the box. For too long, black folks have become like sheep. Scriptures tells us that we are to love the Lord our God with our all heart, mind and strength. This was the first commandment Jesus spoke of. It is a uncompromising princicple. Race doesn’t matter in matters of faith. Political views cannot/should not influence faith, man-made reasoning is what it is…limited.

Hint, Jesus is an anthropomorphism of the Sun. The Sun starts north on December 25th; the return of light to the world.

The Sun dies (stands still) at the vernal equinox, and resurrects on the third day and then passes over the equator (passover).

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I never knew that you could separate candidate from the party he/she represents. Does the candidate separate themselves from the party?

Why does voting for a person mean voting for a party?